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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/29/2001 11:23:51 PM
From: Frederick Langford	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

When I was in college during the Viet Nam days, I saw many of the most aggressive types suddenly become pacifists as they drove their Corvettes to Canada. Fred

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/29/2001 11:34:18 PM
From: Selectric II	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Whew!... Well said.

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/29/2001 11:46:42 PM
From: BirdDog	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

But there's also something known as being educated beyond your intelligence. ROFL.... Is that another definition of a Liberal Democrat? ... ROTFLMAO BirdDog

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/30/2001 12:52:16 AM
From: elmatador	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

<<don't want to have to live in this kind of fear for the rest of my life>> Don't you think the Iraqs feel the same? There are other parts of the world that people are exactly like you: they have brains too.

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/30/2001 1:06:52 AM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Hear, hear. I don't know what anyone did to piss these people off, but I know that I am a target for something I didn't do, just for who I am. But you know what? It doesn't matter. I am not going to point fingers and I don't want anyone else to point fingers. That was then, this is now. No matter who did what to whom in the past, I want these guys stopped. I don't know how to do it. I don't know if anyone knows how to do it. But I am convinced that we will figure it out. We are all in this together.

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/30/2001 2:52:15 AM
From: bela_ghoulashi	Respond to of 281500

Excellent post.

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/30/2001 8:25:44 AM
From: Mao II	Respond to of 281500

Resolve, then, that on this very ground, with small flags waving and tinny blasts on tiny trumpets, we shall meet the enemy, and not only may he be ours, he may be us. {The Pogo Papers, 1953, foreword.} M2

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/30/2001 10:39:01 AM
From: Jill	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Now I don't know about you, but I really don't want to have to live in this kind of fear for the rest of my life. I don't want to have go to sleep, as I did the night of the Pentagon attack (a few miles away), wondering if overnight a biological or chemical agent was released insider the DC beltway. Hawkmoon, unfortunately we can only protect ourselves in a relative way, not an absolute way. There may be periods of greater danger (there was a time in NYC when one crazy guy got the idea of throwing people in front of subway trains, and then for a while a bunch of crazy guys did that, and eventually that "pastime" passed) and lesser danger, but we have new capacities and a world in which 'nations' are not geographically bounded, but ideologically bonded. It is very interesting to me that these groups are called "cells" because cells make up an organism, a greater whole. We will do what we can, but as posts recently pointed out, our situation is very complex--as with Saudi Arabia (and what about the British banks and Saudi Arabia? Britain being our foremost ally). NPR interview this a.m. was talking about face recognition software PLUS other forms of ID creating a multifaceted security blanket--something that must be multifacted and we would HAVE to keep changing or it would be broken fairly easily. It reminded me of the movie Gattaca--where DNA (drop of blood) and thumbprints were used for security, and the protagonist had to buy a fugitive's blood etc...to try and infiltrate The fact is, we are in a new era of history

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (1885)	9/30/2001 7:55:02 PM
From: RocketMan	Respond to of 281500

I don't have any problem with a true pacifist. I met some in the 'Nam days, and they were willing to forego everything they owned or would own for their beliefs. There should be a place for such in our free society. There are not many true pacifists... much fewer than the situational pacifists who head north only when the going gets tough. OTOH, I agree with what you say, and pacifism would not have freed us from Hitler, from Hirohito, or Lenin and Stalin. Or King George. As Sherman said, war is hell, and after many years of peace our nation is understanding that statement. Or, as Patton said, "no bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country." The only difference today is that we need those dumb bastards to die for their cause, their philosophy, their religion, whatever it is they want to die for, we need to assist them in their quest to die.