SI
SI
discoversearch

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor.  We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community.  If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.
Gold/Mining/Energy
SOFC vrs PEM Fuel Cells (Debate Forum)
An SI Board Since June 1999
Posts SubjectMarks Bans
79 11 0
Emcee:  GLE Type:  Unmoderated
I thought it was time we opened a discussion forum that could be the meeting place for Global Thermoelectric and Ballard posters to debate the great fuel cell race. Unless new technology surfaces within the next couple of years.. one of these two companies will be left standing and reaping the rewards of their technological breakthrough through major development in the automotive industry.

The following excerpt is taken from a "Special Situations and Research Commentary" Published by Sarah Hughes, Associate, of Sprott Securities Limited on June 18, 1999. It reads;

The Great Debate: Solid Oxide Versus Proton Exchange Membrane
... The two most common differences between PEMs and SOFCs deal with the large differential in operating temperatures and required use of pure hydrogen by PEMs. PEMs operate at much lower operating temperatures (80 degrees C) compared to most other fuel cell systems. These low temperatures allow for quick start-up times and the use of inexpensive materials, which make PEMs suitable for mass market applications, where space is a constraint and the cost must be extremely low. However, the temperature also contributes to the system's biggest obstacle, the requirement of pure hydrogen. Before these cells can successfully enter the mass market, either a hydrogen fuel infrastructure will take a significant amount of time an money. Although many of the large petroleum producers are currently attempting to develop a feasible fuel infrastructure, there is no guarantee that they will be successful. The problem with hydrogen is that it is an explosive gas with a very low boiling point, and therefore is difficult to store. In terms of the reformer, it not only increases the cost of the system but also its size, both of which will play an important role in the ultimate use of PEMs as a replacement for the internal combustion engine.

In contrast, SOFCs operate at a much higher temperature, and therefore the conversion of natural gas to hydrogen can occur internally. These systems can incorporate an internal fuel reformer in the design, which uses heat from the fuel cell to convert natural gas directly into a hydrogen rich fuel. In addition the SOFC system is significantly less sensitive to impurities in the fuel (such as sulphur) throughout the reforming process, increasing the efficiency and dependency of the sytems. In terms of the stationary markets, the efficiency of the SOFC systems can be dramatically increased (up to 80% to 90%) when the excess heat is used for other purposes. Although the operating temperatures give SOFCs a number of advantages over the PEMs, it also leads to a number of obstacles, including the need for thermal management, high material costs and the dradual degradation of the system.

In terms of the mass market applications, PEMs have received significantly more attention than SOFCs; however, industry experts believe that the required us of hydrogen will delay the successful entry of PEMs into the mass auto market. In the meantime, automobile manufacturers cannot wait for the infrastructure to be built, as they are up against the strict timelines of current emmission legislation. In order to meet the strict deadlines of emission legislation, automotive manufacturers have begun to look for an alternative to PEMs while the hydrogen problem is solved.

Good Posting.. Let the Great Fuel Cell Debate begin
Previous 25 | Next 25 | View Recent | Post Message
Go to reply# or date (mm/dd/yy):
ReplyMessage PreviewFromRecsPosted
79 Stationary Fuel Cells on the Brink - Installed Base to Grow to $20 BillionScoobah-8/24/1999
78 It's unfortunate that you were not able to post the complete Scientific AmeCH4-8/18/1999
77 Congratulations Dr. B. Baker of Energy Research Corporation, U.S.A. will be awaCH4-8/2/1999
76 Ballard/Methanex/PetroCanada Video is HOT!! Last month, when the Canadian FuelRickmas-7/24/1999
75 We might best keep our eye on a third technology...the Alkaline based fuel celsee clearly now-7/24/1999
74 True. But if the prototype did not have any problems then they could go immediSleeperz-7/23/1999
73 Sid, Remember when you were bashing Ballard for problems with prototypes? Now Rickmas-7/23/1999
72 Have you seen the price of Ballard slowly deterioate over the past week. I thinStephen O-7/23/1999
71 Start by spending $6.00 on the magazine . For the record I'm not bashing orCH4-7/23/1999
70 CH4: Sorry, you are still wrong. If you want to trot out the false statements ySid Turtlman-7/23/1999
69 The information is verbatim from Scientific American July 1999 issue and the scCH4-7/23/1999
68 CH4: The depth of your misinformation is indeed impressive: "Santa Clara&Sid Turtlman-7/23/1999
67 Stephen: "Why aren't there more of these marvellous ERC fuel cells in Sid Turtlman-7/23/1999
66 Wow CH4 you continue to impress with the depth of your research. Greg from Edmonton-7/23/1999
65 Santa Clara's two megawatt plant operated for 3,000 hours (125 days) and itCH4-7/23/1999
64 2 million watts from a cell the same size as the GLE cell hey??? blue_chip-7/23/1999
63 Why aren't there more of these marvellous ERC fuel cells in operation? Are Stephen O-7/23/1999
62 Greg: This is really exciting - now GLE has caught up to where ERC was about a Sid Turtlman-7/22/1999
61 Any informed skeptics or believers out there? The latest developments in GLEGreg from Edmonton-7/22/1999
60 Another PEM victory; this one with NYSE: IDA IdaCorp's Nortwest Power SysteScoobah-7/19/1999
59 Hydrogen and PEM's get closer to mass commercialization from this breakthroScoobah-7/17/1999
58 DCHT's PEM Fuel Cell designs and other information can now be viewed at dchScoobah-7/14/1999
57 Was this the thread seeking the skinny on the Hindenburg? ch2bc.org AtScoobah-7/13/1999
56 Sounds like a good application for the PEM. Great news for the companies involvJim P-7/12/1999
55 " One small step for PEM's, One giant leap for Hydrogen ", this tScoobah-7/12/1999
Previous 25 | Next 25 | View Recent | Post Message
Go to reply# or date (mm/dd/yy):